Friday, September 28, 2007

Thoughts on 2.3 Stuff -- Class Changes and Rated WSG

This is going to be rather long, and NO I'm not going there, but I'm due to discuss some things.

Now for some reason beyond my comprehension, there are apparently people who'd rather read my whiny mage PvP opinions than sweet posts about poker. But whatever, I'll break it down on a few recent hot topics.

The 2.3 changes currently published are going to really make WE the only viable spec to play. Picking up over a 100 damage per Frostbolt and a more potent Ice Barrier is hard to turn down. Combine the Detect Magic nerf with the fact that Baller-Spec™ is more about getting free to CC heavily than chain nuking to do big damage and it'll be hard to justify not playing WE in arena, at least 3s and 5s.

The evocation change is obviously nice; the other stuff is mostly PvE relevant and doesn't interest me terribly. The indirect nerf to elemental shaman arena burst will perhaps reduce the gib of 4DPS, but certainly not to the point where 4DPS will no longer be viable, if anything it hits 2345 harder, but the mage damage buff will likely counteract that. The rogue changes will make 4DPS with rogue terrifying and rogues generally ridiculous in 2s/3s, duels, and world PvP.

Wound and MS affecting drains will hopefully reduce warlock dominance in the smaller brackets which should indirectly benefit mages, but isn't going to change the fact that mages basically are required to run with a lock or rogue in 2s and 3s as we simply don't have the crowd control or damage to be a threat by ourselves. The fear ward nerf might honestly end up helping locks more than the drain change hurts, and while WoTF + Fear Ward could be dominating, most arena teams are alliance to take advantage of the previously superior dwarf racials.

What would I have liked to see in 2.3? Trainable Ice Block. LOL. Would 17/44/0 or 33/28/0 with IB even be as strong as WE? I'm leaning towards probably not. I love playing 38/23, but its a joke how powerful some of the frost talents and abilities relatively are. Compare talented Cone of Cold to Blastwave ("gold medal talent"). Blastwave snares for 10% less, does 40% less damage, and has potentially a 500% longer cooldown. It also is shorter range and higher mana cost. Coolio. Dragon's breath? Does no more than CoC either and you could make a similar comparison...except that you can't even use CoC at all if you're DB. Does this make ANY sense? And Slow? Cool.

I don't mean to be an emo faggot, but it strikes me as somewhat retarded that the only PvP viable mage spec is basically the play-like-a-warlock, spam instants, and let your pet win for you one. Yeah, there's some micro to using your pet well. The thing is... it doesn't fucking matter because WE is so overpowered that you can play like total shit, have your pet autoattack your sheeps, miss half your shatter combos, kite like ass, and still win because it hits so fucking hard. For all of us who resisted the urge to re-roll warlock in BC, you've failed, you now fucking play one.

As for that Arcane Shot change, I'm a huge fan. I actually enjoy rebuffing Ice Armor or Molten Armor every 2 minutes in Battlegrounds. I don't cast Arcane Intellect or Dampen on myself in BGs not because of the mana cost and the inevitability of them being promptly dispelled, but because I like to intentionally handicap myself to make the game more challenging by playing without such powerful buffs on my side. I like it almost as much as when I ride by a lock in WSG and then have to run away and eat twice to recover the DoT damage. Spending most of your time in BGs eating to recover DoT damage is awesome, my rolls are delicious, it's a wonder my mage keeps his slim figure.

At least, there's some cool engineering stuff. Now, I'm not a huge fan of how I have to spend an hour doing daily quests to get enough grenades for 2 hours of PvP, but I understand that its actually good for me and good for the game's economy. See if grenades were cheaper, people would use them in arena or in PvE. Can you imagine what would happen to the economy if grenades didn't cost 5g each? I used to spam iron grenades pretty heavily back in WoW 1.0, but I've been told that Blizzard actually twisted the head off a kitten every time I chucked a grenade -- I've seen the box of heads, it wasn't pretty.

One piece of good news is that rated WSG is on the horizon sooner than most of us expected. Lots of people are getting their teams together already, not so much me. I've been trying to convince FH to transfer to Tich to enable us to get some competition for our sick potential WSG squad, but it's gone mostly like this:

Me: I WANT UP IN THAT BG9 SHIT LIKE THAT GIRL IN HEROES
Guild: What?
Me: I WANT IN IT. IN. IT. THINK ABOUT IT.
Guild: bg9?
Me: RATED WSG NIGGAS. FACES, WE CAN SHIT ON THEM.
Guild: You want to do another transfer?
Me: OR MAYBE THAT HARRY POTTER GIRL SHES HOT
Guild: I don't know if we should transfer, it might endanger raiding progress.
Me: NOW HERES A LITTLE STORY I GOTS TO TELL
Nolan: about three bad brothers you know so well
Me: YEAHHHHHHHHHH REP THAT JEW SHIT LIKE ITS FJBJ SALE HALF OFF
Guild Suck: Why would you want rated WSG?
Me: YOUR NOT ON THE TEAM FAGGOT SHUT UP
Guild: We'll talk later, didn't you say you had to leave?
Me: FINE BUT THIS IS SO GOING IN MY BLOG FAGGOTS

So, I don't really know what's up. I know that rated WSG will be absolutely my top priority. One concern is that PvE gear is pretty important for WSG, but I honestly hope they keep it that way. I miss seeing people in different gear and of different specs. It'll be healthy for the game to have the developers try to balance PvP outside of just the arena mindset -- I honestly think it'll lead to better arena balance too. WSG has been forever been one of my favorite parts of WoW; even when my friends were extremely burnt out of WoW, we always had fun messing around in WSG. I've heard rumors that players are already coming out of retirement to lock in spots on teams -- I'm hoping to bring back a few of the old faces for our team. ^^

Back to what 2.3 "needs" -- fire needs a mid tier talent change that is powerful and relevant to PvP. Something that elevates the offensive threat of AP/fire and deep fire mages to compensate for their extreme fragility. Ignite healing debuff? Crit through resilience? Healing by doing damage? Improved burst on scorch and fireblast? Something. Spellsteal still needs significant improvement. Slow needs to be lower mana cost and not single target limited. All the chance to resist everything talents for all classes need to be reworked to being duration reductions. I could go on, but who really gives a fuck, Blue makes changes, we adapt.

48 comments:

Bubbles said...

WHY HAVEN T I BEEN INVITED TO THAT WSG TEAM YET!!!!!!!!!!!

bubbles said...

oh and my biggest concern for 2.3: what am i gona spam now that they took away my detect magic :(

Unclesam said...

"Blue makes changes, we adapt."

so true :/

Kraderif said...

Yeah... well... sorry for spamming... but... you know, I have nothing to do right now, just waiting to leave... and I'm in a good mood... so...

Nice read. :)

Tweedledum said...

Lolzy @ the guild chat, good read though too.

Ironic that talents, which are supposed to be choices, are necessities depending on what you want to do... where is the talent freedom blizz? (ie make fire viable again)

Also why is it that cast time spells are so much more enjoyable than instant spells? Or rather I prefered pvp when i had to cast, can anyone explain why? :P

Raddy said...

If you want to try something fun, try 1v2ing two WE mages as fire. The amount of ownage is hard to describe in words. Especially when they pop nigh invuln and you realize you don't have enough mana to even kill one. ^^

Nolan Bagelson said...

it started way back in history, with Adrock, MCA, and me... MIKE D

Tweedledum said...

I think this leads to the inevitable question....what is reality?

Jasi said...

Raddy come play with me on NZ :P

Anonymous said...

Didn't FH get stomped by Nurfed awhile back on PTRs? Tich aint for you, try senjin.

No really try senjin they're good.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=2040594347&sid=1

Raddy said...

If by get stomped, lose a pretty close game when BoF was not working, then maybe. That was also ridiculously far back in 1.0, way before we even played that seriously. I respect the Nurfed guys a lot, and we learned a lot from playing them, but whatever. =p

I NEVER LEFT 9TH GRADE SORRY

Anonymous said...

The sad thing is that guild chat does look like what he posted.

Anonymous said...

Horde on blackrock rad. =p

Anonymous said...

might i ask where you heard about this incoming 2.3 wsg leage rated pvp match stuff?

Anonymous said...

Too many from FH wouldn't transfer because they couldn't spam BOP PvE items in trade talking about how much other people suck when most of BG9 is months ahead of them. It would be about skill and not gear, which would work for the better members of the guild.

Nimble said...

Raddy I have to say that your posts are becoming hillarious and extremely clever at the same time. I really really love your style; it's very refreshing. I know Ming is looking for a blogger and I really think you should talk to him about it. Sure maybe you don't like him or don't want to lose your own blog but you just plain -deserve- to get compensation.

Anyways, what is this about rated WSG coming sooner than we expected? What specifically I didn't notice the blue posts about that.

Anonymous said...

I haven't seen a single blue post about rated WSG, can someone please enlighten me? :(

zarthustra said...

"Sure maybe you don't like him or don't want to lose your own blog but you just plain -deserve- to get compensation."

wait did you even read his posts

99% of of them are about how he watches porn on his iphone while buying red bull from wannabe hookers at the taj mahal and playing 20 40 no limit hold 'em in 4 different armani suits and giving the new fragrance from prada a test drive but he doesn't really like it so he donated it to the local art center and got a tax writeoff for it, after which he returned home and played world of warcraft on his falcon northwest gaming machine that only cost 8000 bucks and has a custom paint job that says "RADIKAL DOOD", but he's getting kind of sick of the way 'dude' was spelled so he's probably just going to buy another one and donate this one to ethiopia so he can get another tax writeoff because it's the fiscally and morally responsible thing to do, and that lamborghini isn't going to pay for itself.

compensation? fgt plz

Anonymous said...

"The rogue changes will make 4DPS with rogue terrifying and rogues generally ridiculous in 2s/3s, duels, and world PvP"

Yeah running 7% faster and having physical blinds is going to make rogues TERRIFYING. I hope you don't seriously think anyone will spec ShS...

Unclesam said...

"I hope you don't seriously think anyone will spec ShS..."

*cough* ming *cough*

Anonymous said...

i <3 rad

Anonymous said...

Gah giev more funfactor! the GC wasnt enough!!

Good post for a serious one though ^^

Ryan said...

Ignite, a healing debuff is the best suggestion i ever heard. Gogogo, spam the suggestion forum.

Raddy said...

I <3 you all very much.

On the rogue changes, I actually think lots of people will spec deep sub...it's going to a greater opener/finisher spec in 2.3. 7% run speed is huge outdoors, it's basically like going from no boot enchant to boot enchant, but you get the advantage permanently -- if it was any larger, I think it would just be ridiculous.

Oppo said...

Don't forget that deadly throw will no longer be spammable.

A rogue won't be able to have ShS *and* increased runspeed at the same time, but NO rogue will be able to spam deadly throw, and that makes me happy inside.

Raddy said...

DT throw spam was REAL annoying I agree. Might make B speed more appealing now.

Unclesam said...

this -> http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=2040596066&postId=19976344331&sid=1#1

would make blazing speed more appealing!

jordan said...

"Too many from FH wouldn't transfer because they couldn't spam BOP PvE items in trade talking about how much other people suck when most of BG9 is months ahead of them."

http://wowjutsu.com/us/

FH is 9th, top bg9 guild is 13th.

BG9 DE-HYPED AGAIN

Anonymous said...

Don't worry raddy WE is getting nerfed soon. Of course most good teams kill the WE right away anyway. So it'll change very little except the lower brackets and frost mage 1v1.

Anonymous said...

where do you see WE getting nerfed?

Anonymous said...

I'm sympathtic to complaints about the WE. The problem that the WE is "overpowered" is also related to the fact that mages are pretty underpowered without cooldowns. Now I'm not syaing they are unique in this regard, rogues are also very CD dependant for example.

But really what can even a skilled frost mage beat without the WE? Other than warrior? Rogue? no. Druid? no. Hunter? no. etc etc. Not if they are equally geared and know what they are doing. Your just not going to do ENOUGH damage before your clock runs out.

So yeah the WE is stupid. Not only because it's so awesome, but because we are awesomly dependant on it.

It's the new POM/Pyro it just takes it about 20 seconds do the same work that POM/Pyro USED to do.

Anonymous said...

if WE get changed then there is almost no point of pvping unless you like rolling scrubs with no gear in BG's.

maybe once the dmg tax is taken away things will be better but still casting 2.5 spells is a long time vs classes with a ton of interrupts.

Petite-EU said...

where did you get information about rated BGs getting realesed before the addon?

Raddy said...

my names are all taken =(

Oppo said...

Just because there is no talk about a nerf, or even if there is, blizz still retains the power to nerf anything they want.

Remember how people were bitching and moaning about how OP Mortal strike was in arenas, so blizz nerfed hypothermia?

It's the random shit that you don't see coming that is the hardest to adapt to.

affix said...

Raddy, convince FH to merge with Quality Control when you transfer, we have an epic WSG team in the making (we have the best druids on Tichondrius)

PULL THEM STRINGS, BOY~!

Affix said...

PS: Any guild that has Affix, Secretive, Happyminti, Dahis, Isolee and Radikal can't be bad :X

Anonymous said...

OMG all those names in one guild?
WTB more videos :p

rogue4life said...

what!?

fire needs mid tier talent to match the overpowered frost ?

this is no ballance

Anonymous said...

Affix I'm sure FH will stay in your guild as long as Zecks and co did.

dms said...

baller spec ftw!

Anonymous said...

Link to info on rated wsg...

hi raddy still runnin mah spec?

-pv

Raddy said...

Most the time I still play 38/23 yeah

Been playing AP/fire and WE a bit recently too

teki said...

new post raddy omgzplz

Anonymous said...

Rad,

All this talk on builds. PLEASE discuss Fireace's build, he is 2200+ with 0/40/21 build!!!

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Gul%27dan&n=Fireace

I am trying it myself this week...

Anonymous said...

Extra points in frost are better. 0/38/23 ftw

-pv

Raddy said...

No clue how to fix comments >.<

New post inc tomorrow I promise, been busy with RL + InGame DRAMA

affix said...

if you triple click on the links, it highlights the whole uncut link.